John Rogers Gets Real With 'As If It's True'
John Rogers Gets Real With ‘As If It's True’
John Rogers. Jojit Lorenzo for Cinemalaya.
The perception towards the influencer has dramatically shifted over the years: from an agent of actionable change into a person talking to a camera for anywhere between a minute to an hour on the internet. This shift in perception can be attributed to the increasingly inescapable power of social media over our daily lives. And for an enterprising few, they’ve learned how to harness and wield that power for their gain. A popular TikTok creator now possesses as much clout as a government official. This is no Black Mirror episode; this is reality. As our perceptions change, so do our realities. And as we transpose realities, the truth turns into an amorphous thing.
In As If It’s True, a social media influencer and a musician enter a fake relationship in the hopes of resuscitating their respective dying careers. Gemma (Ashley Ortega) and James (Khalil Ramos) agree to exploit each other and trick online audiences into believing their make-believe romance. That is, until the line between true feelings and play-acting blurs.
The film saw its premiere at last year’s Cinemalaya Independent Film Festival and had a relatively underrated showing compared to other similarly-themed movies. I thought it was a solid standout from the festival and one of the few entries that had the most crossover appeal. And someone from high up seemed to agree as well: As If It’s True receives a second life as it becomes available to stream on Netflix (now as you’re reading this!)
In this interview, I spoke with director John Rogers about his inspirations, online culture, and the rocky journey to making his debut feature ahead of its post-Valentine’s streaming release. And a little over a week later, another Cinemalaya alumni arrives at Netflix: Iti Mapukpukaw. Hearing this bit of news, Rogers expresses relief because viewers will have another movie to check out after seeing his. “In case ma-disappoint sila,” he jokes.
But I don’t think anyone will be disappointed when they see the level of craft and talent on display in this film. Anchored by strong performances from Ramos and Ortega, As If It’s True cautions us of the slippery world of social media ruled by influencers, and how the truth that we perceive online may not be what it seems offline.
This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity. An English translation for Taglish answers is also provided below, italicized in a dark-blue text color.
Ashley Ortega and Khalil Ramos in As If It’s True. John Rogers for Cinemalaya.
Can you share how you came up with the story behind As If It’s True?
It really started on wanting to make a character study about an influencer. Within that I decided to tell a type of story that could get produced and appear mainstream enough, so producers can take a chance on the story without it being too risky on the outside.
Is it based on a true story?
Hindi. I guess naging inspired ako sa mga influencer na napanood ko. Nagkaroon ako ng interest sa relationship between an audience watching a movie and an audience watching a personality on the internet. I’ve been in a relationship with a musician and nakita ko ang similarities ng musician and influencer in this online landscape wherein they have to market themselves.
No, I guess I was inspired by the influencers that I’ve watched. I developed an interest towards the relationship between an audience watching a movie and an audience watching an internet personality. I’ve been in a relationship with a musician and I saw the similarities between musicians and influencers in this online landscape where in they have to market themselves.
The personalities of the two main characters, James and Gemma, are quite toxic and rotten. What was your process of characterizing them and did you ever draw a line before they became “too much”?
Essentially, pareho silang stereotype. Sa original version ng meet-cute nila, the conversation revolved around them realizing they’re stereotypes tapos they form a connection. When I was writing [the script] nasa isip ko talaga kontrabida ang character ni Khalil, and bida ang character ni Ashley. May pagka-toxic din [si Gemma] pero naisip ko if we could get a charismatic actress, mag full-circle ang character into being likable. Hindi ko tinitignan in terms of traits or backstory kung sobrang unlikeable na ba sila or hindi. Gusto ko ma-capture with other movies like Gone Girl or any character ni Rosamund Pike recently na dahil siya ang nag-play, you can’t help but watch her and be engrossed by the story because of her. Hindi ko sure if na-achieve talaga ng [As If It’s True] pero ayun ang idea na pinagbasehan ko; it really relied on the two actors more than anything.
Essentially, they’re both stereotypes. In the original version of their meet-cute scene, the conversation revolved around them realizing they’re stereotypes, and then they form a connection. When I was writing [the script], I always thought that Khalil’s character is an antagonist, while Ashley’s is the protagonist. Gemma can be toxic though, but I thought: if we could get a charismatic actress, her character would come full circle and become likable. I don’t see in terms of traits or backstory of whether the characters are very unlikable or not. I want to capture what other movies have done like Gone Girl or any character that Rosamund Pike recently played, where you can’t help but watch her and be engrossed by the story because of her. I’m not sure though if we achieve that [in As If It’s True], but that’s the idea that I based on. It really relied on the two actors more than anything.
In this generation, we see a lot of people online trying to perform or show this certain version of themselves. Why do you think we make an effort to broadcast this version of ourselves online that is different from our real life personas?
I think everyone wants to be liked, and the internet serves a perfect place for that. Before it didn’t have much consequence, na okay lang magsinungaling ka sa internet, pero as time goes on, it gets very complicated that it could have actual consequences. Pero hindi ko ginawa ang [As If It’s True] to make a satire about that. Naging inspiration ko on how to deal with this topic ay Eighth Grade ni Bo Burnham. Burnham came from YouTube and may understanding siya ng internet and how to treat young people with respect when they’re opening up online to get validation from strangers. It’s endearing pero hindi ko alam if naging endearing siya dito sa movie. Hindi ko in-expect na mas naipakita ang not-so-good parts than the endearing parts, which, sa paggawa ng movie, na-realize ko that you can’t really control everything.
I think everyone wants to be liked, and the internet serves a perfect place for that. Before, it didn’t have much consequence, that it’s okay to lie in the internet, but as time goes on, it gets very complicated that it could have actual consequences. But I didn’t create [As If It’s True] to make a satire about that. What inspires me on how to deal with this topic is Bo Burnham’s Eighth Grade. Burnham came from YouTube, and he understands the Internet and how to treat young people with respect when they’re opening up online to get validation from strangers. It’s endearing, but I don’t know if that endearment translates here in my movie. I didn’t expect that it would show the not-so-good parts more than the endearing parts, which, when making the movie, made me realize that you can’t really control everything.
Did you have other narratives besides romance to see how this subject of online culture plays out?
Yes, sa mga earlier draft ng script and sa mga eksenang na-cut sa movie. There were scenes with Gemma navigating her life in a much more detailed way. Nag-evolve lang siya into a romance noong sinusulat ko siya sa CinePanulat. May fellow ako sa workshop who works with influencers and nakwento niya sa akin na may version of a loveteam ang influencers. Since may unique aspect sa Philippine showbiz ang concept ng loveteam, I thought interesting siya to explore in that way.
Yes, in the earlier drafts of the script, as well as many scenes cut from the movie. There were scenes with Gemma navigating her life in a much more detailed way. It only evolves into a romance when I was writing for CinePanulat. I have a fellow workshop attendee who works with influencers, and he told me that influencers have their own version of a loveteam. Since the concept of loveteams is a unique aspect in Philippine showbiz, I thought the idea is interesting to explore in that way.
How was it like working with Khalil Ramos and Ashley Ortega?
Masaya, it was great working with them kahit may mga limitation. Originally, we were trying to get someone else to play Gemma, and ang hirap i-present sa actresses kasi the role doesn’t sound appealing. The original opening scene is gagawa dapat si Gemma ng apology video pero hindi niya kaya umiyak, so nag acting exercise siya by trauma dumping on herself hanggang maiyak siya. If you see the script, sobrang haba niya and siguro ang turn-off when they read it kasi ang daunting niya gawin. Si Jun Lana ang lumapit sa GMA and sila ang nagbigay ng Ashley Ortega and Khalil Ramos. Since nahirapan kami mag-cast, nagkaroon ng less time to work with the two actors preprod, and nagkaroon na lang kami ng one-day workshop and then a separate day of them getting close. Nagulat ako na they managed to have chemistry kahit walang prep, and Ashley was shooting another teleserye at the time. Sa dulong scene where may mahabang monologue si Khalil, he rewrote some of it. Binigyan ko sila ng equal freedom to do what they want kasi the role really lives or dies with their performance and kung ano maibibigay nila as actors.
It was fun. It was great working with them even with the limitations. Originally, we were trying to get someone else to play Gemma, and it was hard pitching it to actresses, because the role doesn’t sound appealing. The original opening scene is: Gemma is trying to create an apology video, but she couldn’t cry, so she did an acting exercise where she trauma-dumps on herself until she finally cries. If you see the script, the scene is very long, and I guess it’s quite a turn-off when they read it, because the scene is daunting to do. Then, Jun Lana approached GMA, and they offered Ashley Ortega and Khalil Ramos. Since the casting process was difficult, we had less time to work with the two actors in pre-production as a result. We only had one-day workshop, and then a separate day of them getting close. I was surprised to see that they managed to have chemistry without any prep, and Ashley was also shooting another teleserye at the time. In a later scene where Khalil had a long monologue, he rewrote some of it. I gave them equal freedom to do what they want, because the role really lives or dies with their performance, and what they can bring as actors.
One scene I recall was the intense breakfast argument between James and Gemma. How was it like directing this particularly dramatic scene?
Since limited lang [ang time], my AD Mark said ilang eksena lang ang ma-workshop for this day, so sinama ko na ang away nila sa breakfast. Mostly pinabayaan ko lang sila [Khalil and Ashley] to do what they want, kung ano ang interpretation nila ng scene. Technically, wala masyadong actual directing on set when it came to shoot it; I just accepted what they gave me and nag-work out siya.
Since we only have limited time, my AD Mark said that only a select few scenes can be workshopped for this day, so I included the breakfast argument. Mostly I let [Khalil and Ashley] work on the scene, to do what they want, figure out their interpretation on it. Technically, there’s not much actual directing on set when I came to shoot it; I just accepted what they gave me, and it worked.
As a writer, do you take into consideration how audiences will react when writing these kinds of scenes?
Yeah. With this [breakfast scene], eto ang naging pinaka-favorite ng crew kasi ayun ang [highlight] ng movie for them. I think kung ano ang magiging reaction ng audience, and since may pagka-people pleaser ako, it really influences my writing. Humihingi ako ng validation from other people kung nagagandahan sila sa eksenang ito.
Yeah, with this [breakfast scene], it’s the crew’s most favorite, because it’s the highlight of the movie for them. I think whatever will be the audiences’ reaction, and since I can be a people pleaser, it really influences my writing. I seek validation from other people whether they are impressed with a scene.
And this is your first full-length, right?
Eto ang pinakauna kong sinulat as a serious script. Passion project siya na sa akin lang. Pagka-graduate ko sineryoso ko ‘tong medyo joke-y script. Before eto nagawa, may mga nasulat ako ilang episodes na lumabas for iWantTFC’s Lyric and Beat. But as a director, yeah. Meron noong college pero I don’t know if you’d count that.
This is my first serious script that I wrote. It’s a passion project for me. After I graduated, I took my semi-jokey script seriously. And before I did this, I wrote some episodes for iWantTFC’s Lyric and Beat. But as a director, yeah. I did some directorial work back in college, but I don’t know if you’d count that.
What would be the most challenging and rewarding part of directing this movie?
The rewarding part is when you shoot a scene and it’s working kasi ayun ang main thing about making a movie on this scale, na may ganitong professionalism with other professionals. Technically, this movie was made within the showbiz system since it cast Khalil and Ashley from GMA na may pangalan, and it had to work within that system unlike sa ibang [Cinemalaya] entries na may auditions to get actors for the roles. And I guess the challenging part is working within that system, na at the mercy ka ng mga taong hindi mo makikilala all throughout the production. Pero the rewarding part is you get to watch the scenes you wrote years ago finally work.
The rewarding part is when you shoot a scene and it's working because that's the main thing about making a movie on this scale, that there’s professionalism with other professionals. Technically, this movie was made within the showbiz system since it cast Khalil and Ashley from GMA with names, and it had to work within that system unlike other [Cinemalaya] entries that have auditions to get actors for the roles. And I guess the challenging part is working within that system, that you are at the mercy of people you don't know all throughout the production. But the rewarding part is you get to watch the scenes you wrote years ago finally work.
Do you have any upcoming projects?
Wala (laughs). Writing this was four years of my life so may pagka-Horcrux na siya; it became a part of me for so long tapos ngayon wala na siya, I just feel empty. In writing my own passion projects, sinusubukan kong magsulat for an actor or an actress na napanood ko and really admire. But I’m writing something and hopefully hindi lang siya maging script. As for directing, wala.
None (laughs). Writing this was four years of my life so there’s a bit of a Horcrux in itself; it became a part of me for so long and now it’s gone, I just feel empty. In writing my own passion projects, I try to write for an actor or an actress that I watch and really admire. But I'm writing something and hopefully it won't just be a script. As for directing, nothing.
Lastly, at SINEGANG.ph we ask filmmakers to share their TAPSILOG movies: tapa = your favorite movie, sinangag = your comfort movie, and itlog = a movie recommendation.
(Tapa) Yi Yi by Edward Yang. (Sinangag) Weird na comfort movie pero ang saya niyang panoorin and naging inspiration for As If It’s True is Phantom Thread. (Itlog) I recommend people to watch Gitling kasi maganda siyang movie and isa sa mga bright spots ng batch namin sa Cinemalaya.
(Tapa) Yi Yi by Edward Yang. (Sinangag) It's a weird comfort movie but it's fun to watch and it has become the inspiration for As If It's True, Phantom Thread. (Itlog) I recommend people to watch Gitling because I think it’s a beautiful film and It’s one of the bright spots from our batch at Cinemalaya.
As If It’s True is now streaming on Netflix.
